From: firstname.lastname@example.org (Brad)
Subject: Sexual Harrassment
Below is the result of your feedback form.
It was submitted by Brad (email@example.com)
body: Well, where do I start but by saying, YES !!!!
I am so glad to see a site like this. As I write this letter
I say to you SoCoOL Bob,"Way to go on winning your case."
Also while I write this I am looking over my deposition as
first day of court for me is tomorrow 2-9-98. It has taken
2 years for this to happen and I finally get my day in court.
And the story goes like this ..........
A woman whom I was friends with was working part-time at a
fitness center where I work and my parents own. She then came
to work full time for us (notice I didn't say me )after
working part-time for around a year. She came to me to ask
for the full time position but I told her I didn't do the
hiring that it was left up to the General Manager (a female).
Well needless to say she was hired and worked there about
3 months. Once working full time we became close. She
would tell me about past relationships and problems she had
in her life, including her current relationship she had.
She was obviously unhappy because she would talk about leaving
him and asked me on several occasions to take her jet skiing
and out to dinner. I never did either of her requests.
I am not going to sit here and say I was mister innocent, but
the point is SHE spoke freely as I did. I never did talk about
sex with her though, at leasts not between us. We would both
talk about sexual issues, with her bringing up one important
part of anal sex. She told me she was having problems with her
intestines. Something about the fact that they were deteriorating
and she may have to have surgery and it bothered her because she
like to have anal sex ( if that isn't inviting me into her private
life I don't know what is ).
Well, in December of 96 she was going
get breast implants done and that's all she could talk about.
She talked to me about them, as in what size I thought she should get
and she asked others also. Did I give her an answer, well of
course I did, BUT she invited me too. Well she finally gets her
implants and she is healed from her surgery ( before her surgery
she wore tshirts and other big clothing to hide herself ) she
walks in to the gym in a halter top READY to workout. The FIRST
thing she does is come into my office ( thanks god a female
employee was in the office at the time )and asks me if I think
her breasts look too big in the top she was wearing. Did I
give a response, of course I did, like I said I am no angel in
One night after the gym had closed she asked me again
about the size of her breasts. She was wearing a sweatshirt, with
no bra I might add. I told her there is know way for me to
know if I though they were too big because I had never seen
them before. Well, she grabs me by the hand and says follow me.
She takes me back into the female locker room and proceeds to
pull her shirt up. Did I look, what do you think? I gave her
my opinion and then we left for the night.
Well, on another night we are talking together about
her relationship ( I was single then ) and then she started
talking about us and what it would be like for us to go out.
Before she left I made the comment " Well you really don't
if your compatible until after you kiss." Well at that moment
she put her left hand on my right shoulder and leaned over, we
embraced and we kissed, she pulled back and looked at me, smiled and
then we kissed again. She smiled at me and said, I'll see you
Well then SLAM !!!! The very next day when she comes into work
she pulls me into my office (alone) and states she has talked
to a lawyer and this is sexual harrassment. I told her
"Bull Shit" and I then confronted her about her showing me
her breasts and her kissing me and talking about relationships
and her breasts. She quickly calmed down and said she needed
to think about things.
2 days later she comes in and says she has
thought about it and she is not going to sue. She tells me
she wants no further contact from me and I told her "Nothing
will ever happen again between us."
Well, she quits a month later and SLAM again...a law suit.
Here are her allegations:
- I harrassed her from day one - When she was working part-time
and continueing to full time.
Note: She left a job making 2.50 more and came to work on
a shift she didn't want to work.
Also, if she was being harrassed part-time why in
the hell would she want further abuse full time.
- That I reapetedly(sp) grabbed her breasts and rubbed up
against her buttocks while up at the front desk.
Note: Keep in mind this is a 21,000 sq ft club with 2,000
members. And yet NO-ONE saw anything.
- She claims in her deposition that she NEVER talked about
her breast implants to anyone.
Note: I have myself, and at least 2 others (both fem)
as witnesses that she did talk about them.
- She claims I asked to take her Jet-Skiing all the time.
Note: In fact she asked me ALL the time.
- She claims that I made rude and sexual comments to her
on a repeated basis and that she never said anything.
Note: Well lets start with ANAL SEX,Breasts, and sex in
Now to me and what is going to happen in court tomorrow along
with some background with me.
Let us compare the two people here with FACTS:
ME: High School Grad / U.S. Air Force w/Honorable Discharge
Police Academy Grad / Been a Part-Time police officer
for 4 yrs now
1 1/2 years of college /
HER:High School Grad / Tried to commit suicide (hospitilized)
Cocaine addict / psych. problems since age 8-She hears voices/
Tried to commit suicide in her late teens (hospitalized)/
All of the above is documented through discovery of records
but hell she told me about most of it so my lawyers knew to
go after it. She just seemed to leave out the fact that she
heard voices and had psych problems.
Well, here is what the courts are doing to me:
They have surpressed her psych records, cocaine problems,
her problems with keeping relationships.
And just recently they have forbid us about talking about
her (as they put it) breast augmentation. DO YOU FUCKING
BELIEVE THAT.. Needless to say that is just about my whole
case. Now her side can present her as a SWEET ANGEL.
Personally I still can't believe this has gone to court.
Oh yeah, did I mention that the judge hearing this case
is a WOMAN.
Also one last thing. This woman who is suing is claiming
that I ruined her relationship with the man she was living with.
Well, because the courts forbid it, we are not allowed to
bring up the fact that while dating this SAME man and 4
months after she filed the case. She slept with a different
man on a Friday night and then on the following Saturday a
totally different man asked her to marry him and she said
"YES" all while the present boyfriend was out ot town. I am
not going to be able to even bring that up. IS THAT NOT
AMAZING TO YOU? It is to me ........
How has this affected me?
Well for the 1st year and half I trusted no one. I was harsh
and cold to people. People began to here what had happened a
and those that didn't know me that heard things third hand
thought I was a pig. Those that knew me ( both men & women )
said NO WAY could I have done that. Needless to say I was
not myself for a full year at least. I have felt and still
feel like I have been raped mentally. I have headaches alot
more and I can't buy a thing ( and haven't for 2 yrs )for fear
of losing it should I lode the case for some damn reason.
The whole case is he said she said. I do have 2 witnesses to
that fact that she talked about here breasts but they might not
even get to talk about it. Well, for the past 6 months I have
done much better, I fainally just said "Screw It" and started
being myself again and people are really backing me.
I hope I win my case and will let you know how it goes if you
like. I feel sorry for anyone that has to go through this
and I hope that people can learn something by what I have told.
My Lawyer bills are already up to $11,000 which is costly to
me as I am having to defend myself. And by the way, you should of
seen her lawyers mouths drop when I said I own no stock in the
company ( my parent own it ). And they also keep talking
settlement and I told them that would be admitting guilt in
my eyes and I'll see you in court!!!! I feel this case is
such a joke, but in real terms it is NO JOKE at all. It is
scary and if one loses to a SCAM case can haunt them for life.
Good luck to any of you that read this and are fighting a false
caim. I feel for you and know what you are going through.
To all you women out there - I know it is the small number
of women out that that hurt your name and hopefully the women
of the world will stand up and take notice of this problem that
haunts many men.
My Definition of SEXUAL HARRASSMENT :
Anytime a person uses his/her power to help another gain while
employed through sexual acts after the employee has refused such
help or gain.
Anytime a person (m or f) makes "sexual" remarks to another, and
is TOLD by that person that they find those kinds of remarks
offensive, and they continue with the remarks even after being
told they are offensive.
Do you feel the same as I do? Just curious....
Thanks for your time,
" WHY MEN CAN'T WIN"
If this were treated as a crime would her behavior called ENTRAPMENT ?
I wish it didn't exist ... I wonder how many repetitions before
it might sink into the mind of everyone that there's something
seriously wrong here ... that needs to be fixed.
Hopefully, you'll do as I'm doing, and at least try to picture
a world of our making, where this kind of thing was not
possible, and that real issues of sexual harassment might
be dealt with in everybody's interest.
As they used to say, and I still say, in my Carnegie days,
you don't have to have a clue how it's going to happen,
just set the goal.
My new definition of SEXUAL HARASSMENT is becoming almost
anybody who accuses someone else of SEXUAL HARASSMENT.
After all, I've certainly never experienced anything much more
Harassing than what was done to me, and it wouldn't have occurred
except for my sex. Unfortunately, I been harassed by the best of
them, and I don't mean women and I don't mean sex.
It seems to me some significant effort needs to take place.
If we're going to have a 'action' called sexual harassment, that
it be taken OUT OF THE COURTROOM. It's bull !!! I hate to say
it but .. perhaps this ... which is supposed to be a joke, says it
best. I publish it with my sincerest apologies to any man or woman
who might be offended. It is intended as a series of jokes.
If it has a reality too it, then maybe we can laugh and learn ???
If you put this up on the office wall, would it be Sexual
- If you put a woman on a pedestal and try to protect her
from the rat race, you're a male chauvinist
- If you stay home and do the housework, you're a pansy.
- If you work too hard, there is never any time for her.
- If you don't work enough, you're a good-for-nothing bum.
- If she has a boring repetitive job with low pay,
this is exploitation.
- If you have a boring repetitive job with low pay, you
should get off your ass and find something better.
- If you get a promotion ahead of her, that is
- If she gets a job ahead of you, it's equal opportunity.
- If you mention how nice she looks, it's sexual harassment.
- If you keep quiet, it's male indifference.
- If you cry, you're a wimp.
- If you don't, you're an insensitive bastard.
- If you thump her, it's wife bashing.
- If she thumps you, it's self defense.
- If you make a decision without consulting her, you're a
- If she makes a decision without consulting you, she's a
- If you ask her to do something she doesn't enjoy,
- If she asks you, it's a favor.
- If you appreciate the female form and frilly underwear,
you're a pervert.
- If you don't, you're a fag.
- If you like a woman to shave her legs and keep in
shape, you're a sexist.
- If you don't, you're unromantic
- If you try to keep yourself in shape, you're vain.
- If you don't, you're a slob.
- If you buy her flowers, you're after something.
- If you don't, you're not thoughtful.
- If you're proud of your achievements, you're up on
- If you don't, you're not ambitious.
- If you're totally beat after a hard day's work, you
don't give a crap about other people's needs.
- If she has a headache, she's tired.
- If you have a headache, you don't love her anymore.
- If you want it too often, you're oversexed.
- If you don't, there must be someone else.
Of which sex ???
Hey ... Don't Forget About Me
So ... How Is This Case Coming Out ?
It was submitted by Brad (firstname.lastname@example.org)
I wrote you awhile back about a case that went to trial on
2/9/98. Not sure if you remember me or not. Well I lost
the case and will appeal in April after the hearing of how
much money I am really suppose to pay.
The judge was a woman
and she let all of the plantiff's testimony in and restricted
mine. It was out and out outrage. I cannot believe the justice
FACTS: This girls OWN sister got up and testified
that she was doing it for the money. I had a witness testify
that she (the plantiff) walked into my office and say
you think my breasts are too large?" This is after she had
gotten breast implants. ( by the way this is happening in a
fitness center where I worked ) Then, after the plantiff
testified to the fact that I supposedly ruined her relationship
with a boyfriend the judge didn't allow the following:
Ok, the plantiff contends that I ruined her relationship with
a guy named Mike. Well, 4 months later, after the case was filed,
the plantiff has a guy come to her house (boyfriend Mike and her
lived in the same house ) while Mike was out of town. This
was on a Friday ( this is known because her sister had spent
the night on that night ). On Saturday a totally different
guy came over (still Mike is out of town) and asks her to marry
him and she say's "YES". The judge ruled this as irrelevant
to the case. IRRELEVANT, SHIT....she claims I ruined her
relationship and she states she has trouble being with men.
THAT IN MY OPINION "WAS" the case.
Well needless to say.....
The case was broadcast on 2 TV stations ( not during the trial
but after ) and is due to be in 3 different papers. My life
is ruined as of now and I have lost my Police Officer position
(I was working part-time) and I have lost my job at the
fitness center. SO in one single blow by a girl with a history
of mental problems (drinking at age 8), trying to kill herself
at age 18 or 19 and a history of hearing voices and taking
depression drugs my life has been ruined. Anyway, you can
print this if you like .....just thought you might like to
know that I feel the Justice System "SUCKS."
P.S. Could you send me that joke list again? It is the one
that states if men do this then this is what they are. I found
it funny and realistic.
February 13, 1998 .... CNN ... Middle School Bans Hugging
Video of Story
SoCoOL Visitors ... Continue Sitting On Your Hands OR
> From: Ironman
Man, THis sexual Harrassment stuff IS out of control. I can't
believe that the lawyer thought it was bullshit and still wanted,
But wait, have heard this before? Yes, yes I think I have. My
lawyer said the same thing. Ha Ha The reason why he wanted to
settle is to save me money and he said "just cause I think your
innocent doesn't mean a jury will. And in my case he was right cause
I lost. Hmmmmm
Well anyway, I have a question for you. When this happened to you,
did your friends back you up and support you? Mine have and it has
been great. The funny thing is, you really find out who your
friends are when something bad happens. Well I was just curious.
I don't know that I can say .. one way or the other .. controversy ..
pain .. sorrow ... sadness ... everybody has enough of those thintgs
in their life ... I suspect we all tend to shy away from the pain of
I'll say one thing about sexual harrassment. I wonder when they will make it mandatory that there has got to be "proof" of whatever is alleged.
Example : A witness. A tape recording of sexual
comments WITH the accuser asking for the comments to stop and the
comments continue. Or any other "hard" (no pun intended) evidence.
He said she said is ridiculous.
You know I still think this must be removed from the legal arena ..
it doesn't belong there. Yes, make it necessary to prove the
allegations, yes .. make the process before going to court a 'real
one,' ( the process they have now is a blank check ) yes require
no cost mandatory arbitration and/or counseling ..
Now .. we're getting somewhere ô¿ô
Anyway, Thanks for your time and input,
Thank you ..
You can see we must not be alone. SoCoOL Comments on Sexual
Harassment continue to appear in The Top Ten ..
Just Say Yo !!!