SoCoOL Visitor's Respond
submitted by Chyna
Persomally I feel sexual harassment gets a business no where as far as competition wise. Because if you think about it once a business is known for it's cases of sexual harassment it will be the hardest to get the best people to for or with them. I know I personally wouldn't work for a company who judges the person by their sex. And that will cause them to loose out on some really valuable work or workers. And that might be the work or worker that takes that business to the top.
From: (Michelle Gowan- Gowan Risk Management Services)
Good article- Lots of thoughts on the subject. Gives a new perspective.
It was submitted by Crystal (firstname.lastname@example.org)
Sexual Harassment is a huge issue. Their are so many times that I have wanted to just smack a guy for something he has said to me. I also have to admit that I have watched my friends direct a comment at a "member of the opposite sex" and they have totally taken it out of context. I think people need to learn to relax and not take everything so serious. Sure sexual harassment is a horrible experience but a a joke will always be a joke.
If she was going to get the car lot for sexual harrassment from the begining I would say she was wrong. But, I am a firm believer that there are two sides to every story.. I also believe that when you do wrong to people that it comes back to you ten fold..
So if she did wrong it will come back on her in one way or another..
Absolutely ... I agree 100% ...
If a person develops the habit of operating their Triangle in a negative fashion .... it will affect EVERYTHING THEY DO ...
I Said (email@example.com)
Personally, when a girl sexually harasses me (which happens all the time), I enjoy it. It makes me feel special that someone cares enough to take the time to comment about me and my body personally.
It was submitted by Sandy (sorry!! about to graduate!)
I just wanted to let viewers know that similar things happen in Australia everyday too. I am about to graduate from a bachelor of Nursing degree at the University of Western Sydney, Hawkesbury campus (Australia) and have for the past 3 years been involved with the residential community in a peer educators on sexual assault and have now realized that it is not until we are educated on the prevelance and incidence of this that people will feel comfortable talking and admitting that this may have happened to them!!
Hi, I am a freshmen and I had a problem with one of my teachers, and the school board said that it classified as sexual harassment charges. I came to school with a hickey, and the teacher said that I was giving him the impression that I was easy or loose. I started crying and he laughed and said that I needed to learn how to take stuff. Then, the next day, in front of the whole class, he started calling me "sucker" and making kissing noises at me.
The law for where I am states that a teacher cannot make remarks of a sexual nature that are uncomfortable to the person. Anyway, I thought I'd share my story.....Amy
From: firstname.lastname@example.org (Michael J. Ryan)
My Comments: Define "Sexual Harassment" ??? Do women wish to be treated as equals in the workplace BUT they must be considered as "different" when it relates to anything of a sexual nature??? Is it sexual harassment for one individual to tell another individual that they look particularly "sexy" toady??? If the male says it then we have sexual harassment BUT if the female says it then it isn't??
Michael ... throughout your EMail you "appear" to me to be right on ! What does everybody else think ???
The problem is with the Legal system in this country. A female complains and consults an attorney it is immediately a case taken on "Contingency"... If a male complains and consults an attorney he is shown the door...Fairness, Equality??
This is the absolute truth of what happened to me. Have you had other experiences with this exact same phenomenon ??? I consulted with several attorneys who told me in shades of we don't think you have a cause of action against anybody ... but you can come in and talk about it some more if you like for $150.00 per hour. No ... absolutely not ... would any of them consider taking a cross complaint against any of the parties for any thing they could think of. ( I might add that SoCoOL Bob attended two and a half years at Hastings College of Law ... and scored in the top 1% in the nation on the Natinally Sanctioned LSAT exams. ... so we were able to speak candidly).
Change the system of "Contingency Cases".. Some countries already have the "Court Rules" that the losing party MUST pay the other parties Legal expenses.. Meaning that if the Plaintiff's case is found to have no merit then they must pay for not only thier own Attorney BUT the Defendant's Attorney fees..
Doubt anything so radical as that would occur in the near future? Wonder why causes of action like Sexual Harassment are created for court systems to deal with anyway. This is not an adversarial kind of problem ... if one is truly seeking a cure. Men and women will not come together by squaring off against each other ....
Also in Civil Cases the jury is not allowed to be told if the Defendant has an Insurance Carrier covering the possible judgement. Thus a finding for the Plaintiff often results in the taking of all the Defendant's worldy possessions and a lien on future earnings.. Individuals without coverage have had judgements against them for as high as $250,000. All for a matter of making an improper sexual remark in the workplace. How many MEN can afford to pay that and still survive???
Attorneys have found a CASH COW and we the Public have allowed it.... THIS ABSOLUTELY HAS TO BE THE CASE !!!!
Submitted by email@example.com (jim mangano)
Subject: Re: sexes
Sorry it's taken me a while to find the time to complete a response, but here goes:
I worked for the NYS Gov.'s Office of Employee Relations and am a male victim of sexual harassment, hostile work environment, and intimidation in a female controlled office. I was punched in the stomach just above the groin, poked in the chest, endured this sign posted in the office frequented by the public:"All men are idiots, I married their King"I had my manhood ridiculed in a public forum by the founding mother of the NYS employee day care center movement when she said:"Is there really a "man" in the room?" ( the entire room of females had a good hardy laugh at that comment. Naturally when I complained I was told I was "too sensitive.")I was told in a training meeting that:" I was one of those angry white males." (Naturally when I brought this up to the group, I was told I was too sensitive and didn't really "know" the speaker.)I was told by a trainer in public group that real nurturing love is Mother's love, by the Human Resource administrator that the office didn't need sensitivity/diversity training unless someone was on the verge of committing suicide. Then, when I tried to get a coworker to fulfill her part of a team work assignment, she accused me of sexual harassment and even brought in accusations by using fictitious conversations about my child. As a result of my standing up to my superiors, I was "downsized" from my political appointment and had to take a $10,000 cut in pay. Naturally they said that it was because of the change in the administration, Gov. Pataki. It should also be noted that my "downsizing" occurred 3 days after I wrote to Pataki to set up an office of males in government, since he already inherited an office of females in gov.
When I went to work of the NY Lottery, I have been subjected to having to listen in public to a female say,"I'm not talking to men today. They make me mad. You know you men have that stupid gene."When the Director , an attorney, was informed of this incident he withdrew his open door policy and has refused to address the issue. When the Director of Personnel , a female, was informed, she did nothing and tried to make me the problem.
On Take your child to work day, one female secretary yelled to the other without knowing if there were any children nearby for their marketing tour:"Hey, (name), Bitch"!! ( The comment was not stated in anger, but in jest.)When the speaker saw me in the room, all she said was:"Oh, he's here, now I probably get in trouble".She knows that she doesn't have to worry, because she is a female and they are not subject to the same rules that males are. When the VP is apprised, he'll just say:" I don't believe it".As far as legal remedies. What a joke if you're a male, specifically a white male. The NYS Division of Human Rights has been "investigating my case" for over a year. The Hispanic, visually challenged employee who has been assigned who report to two other minority supervisors, refuses to respond to my letters and personal visits to find out what the status of his investigations is. When there was one meeting on my case against my female manager, I gave him the tape recording of an incident with my manager, and he subsequently threatens to call off the investigation if I ask for the tape back. Fortunately, I made another copy of the tape. This whole case is being politicized behind the scenes by the higher powers in the Gov. Office. At one time they told me that they would make my life miserable because they have the power and the tax payer dollars to support their effort. All I have is my own personal resources. The newspapers and media magazines have not even taken my case, but they have written and aired stories when a female just breathes that something may have happened to her, or that she may be thinking of filing a law suit.
In some way the only way to improve the situation would be to treat females with the same disrespect that you treat males with. Bring them up on charges, ruin their careers on just accusations, work behind the scenes to prevent their transfers as they have done mine, and then don't apologize or help them when they are down and out. Eliminate all access to the media and hundreds of government support groups for these sexist, bashing organizations. Or in a positive sense, fund the male organizations equal to the number of female groups (Our Title IX) and take the stigma away from media covering male victims. Having worked in the field of early childhood, the greatest myth is that females are natural nurturers. The female is the predator.
The other thing you can do is to allow males on fora to speak about their experiences. I try to speak in public groups and they won't allow me, but put up a female with the same "issue", she's supported by everyone in the community to speak. This is just the tip of the iceberg. I hope this fills in some of the blanks.
Thanks Jim ...
As always .... SoCoOL visitors especially appreciate you're sharing of personal experience.
I suspect there are many answers to the dilemna of all of our "human" imperfections. I question whether some of our current behaviors can't be improved.
We are trying to teach each other "not" to discriminate ... when discrimination is an important part of each of our abilities to achieve our own and collective goals. To be able to tell the difference between right and wrong ... to acknowledge and create with the difference between men and women ... ro recognize each person for their own unique culture and personality. This is what we want .... to be able to discriminate and achieve ... for the better.
The recent very public example of two short sentences from a professional golfer and entertainer like Fuzzy Zoeller ... demonstrate how we currently "discriminate" and apply different meanings to words spoken by ...in this case .... white males. Had Charlie Sifford chosen the exact same words .. we would not be crucifying him .... we probably wouldn't even have publicized them. Lee Elder has, perhaps, taken the name of the Lord in vain a time or two .... or oggled an attractive female. So has ... Tiger Woods. But, in this case, we don't even allow the potentially slighted to respond ... themselves .... Let Tiger Woods say to Fuzzy Zoeller ..."Hey Dude ... Next time would you do me a favor and consider calling me something other than a little boy ????"Which would you prefer ???
"Hey man .... I apologize. You see when you're an old stroker like me .... ya can't help but smile with affection ... when a young, handsome, sincere physical specimen like yourself ... just comes along and "smokes em."
Care to protest the next "Skins Game," cause it speaks derogatorially of a particular racial group ... or promotes obscenity ???
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